Trading NR7 setup

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Satyen

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After the breakout, market can not go indefinitely in one direction. It has travelled 550 pts (12-13%). How much more you would expect it to travel in one wave ?
It is quite obvious that it will find support somewhere / shorts will start booking profits and we will see the reversal.

As a trader, we can't live with fixed view about the market. We got to make an opinion based on our defined method. Then keep validating if the factors are still intact.
It is important to define our own parameters to identify the trend reversal.

As a trader, we need at the minimum
1) tool set to identify the current trend (up/down/sideway).
2) toolset to identify the end of trend
3) toolset to identify the reversal of trend

It needs to put your thoughts in proper order. You can extend the approach and also start looking a confirmation signals for each of the three points.
Try to keep this simple and avoid getting into analysis - paralysis while doing this.

Take an example -
1) NR7 give us a trigger that new trend is going to start. So we get ready and start watching for entry signal
2) Next day market breaksout and depending on the direction we know that new trends has started.
3) As an example, Lets follow 3 moving averages (3bar/ 5bar/13bar) to guide us as long as trend is in place or not. As long as they are nicely arranged, we are in trend.
4) Lets use same 3 averages to show us end of trend - when we see 3 bar MA changeing direction and penetrating 5bar MA, we know the market is telling us something.
What action to take, depends on individual. Some will book profit on first sign of weakness. Some will wait for 10 more confirmations before changing their view that market has
reversed. Some will just tighten the stops.
5) To confirm the reversal, you might like to see, 1 Higher Low pivot as first signal. For confirmation of reversal, u might like to see the break of downward sloping Trendline.

These are just an example to get u thinking. Please spend some time and define your indicators / signal / market pattern etc and then just watchout for it.

In my view, we have retraced 63% of the move that started from 3500 level to 4700 level. (1200 pts move, 63% gives approx 750 pts . i.e. from 4700 we came down by 750 pts).
Typical fib level where mkt finds support. Various 50/ 200 dma lines are also in the same zone. 4000 is nice psychological support level.
all these factors makes 4000 an important support level which it did nicely.

Generally when we look at big timeframe charts, we need to see the number of bars market has spent below/above a level. In current case, mkt just spent 1 day (friday) below 4000 and bounced back from there. That too was a narrow range day of 85 points. Though it did not flag as NR7 day because of previous days action.. but if we observe the daily range closely, then in my observation, I have found all days with less then 100 pts range (i.e. 2.5% to 2.8% of current price) act as narrow days. and they indicate possible breakout.
And we see the result now.

Hope this helps.

Happy Trading.
Ok I am Spaming By Quating But need to Type Thank You
 

lazytrader

Well-Known Member
Re: My two cents on NR7s, ID/NR4s, Double NR7s

Hello Satyen and Lazy Trader,
Was going through these posts and thought I could post my experiences.

1. Crable's patterns do work very well; which's why he didnt republish his original book(first print was 2000 copies; now an original is a collectors item costing in 100s of dollars and less if you are lucky). I heard he runs a hedge fund worth Billions. I remember hearing in one of Linda's(LBR) long ago that his average profit per trade for his hedgefund was 17 bucks. Obviously one must learn how to build the number of contracts traded without sacrificing risk.

2. I use NR7s, double NR7s, ID/NR4s as a filter in that at the end of the day if my daily data alerts me to these situations, the next day I switch to breakout mode. All these things are old hat, mentioned so well by Linda in her book Street Smarts. I also use historical volatility ratios to filter those issues that are contracting in range. Why trade something where there's nothing going on?

3. You can trade breakouts in any time frames and all these patterns work in any time frame. One of the best methods to trade breakouts is to figure out the critical range and then add a percent to it and this could change based on volatility of the markets.

4. I love double Nr7s. Sometimes you don't get a breakout after the first NR7 but the next day you get another NR7. This happens but only a few times for say bonds or s&P(dont know for Nifty yet) in a year but when it happens it could lead to explosive moves lasting a few days on the daily chart.

Once range expands, say a big breaktout, then I switch back to swing trading. If I get a wide range 9(widest range for the past 9 days) or a break out in general the next day I switch to Zzzzz mode(not much happening here)so basically try to pick the intraday high and low and maybe take one trade on both sides(support and resistance).

Thanks so much
Shreenath
Can you explain critical range or tell me where I can find the explanation?
 

AW10

Well-Known Member
Yes Very Right Vineet Bhai .......... Just amzing yes we need these people to pull us upwards
Satya / Vineet, there is not limit to knowledge.. I am also learning. More I read, more I feel about my ignorance.

I agree with LT's comment that it doesn't matter how much one knows. Lot of Knowledge without the action is useless. Contrary to that, even small bit of knowledge, but put into action is lot more productive.
I still find it difficult to maintain the balance of reading and Action within reasonable limit. Working on adopting the approach of marking 1 day in the week as "No Reading, Only Action" day. Lets see how long I can continue with it.

Happy Trading.
 

AW10

Well-Known Member
Hi Shreenath. Good to see your interest in Toby's patterns.

Have you done similar work on ID/NR4s?
I consider IDNRx setup as subset of NRx setup so don't scan for them seperately. ID (Inside day), whether it is NR or not, always is good pattern to monitor. It indicates the conslidation. By default
as soon as you have ID, you are guranteed to have NR2 day atleast.

If you are interested we could work together on developing a system to trade the breakouts for both NR7s and ID/NR4s. I know you already have yours but since you have extended an offer to learners here, I thought I could learn from what you do.
Shreenath, certainly we can discuss here and develop a system. For benefits of others who would like to develop a system, I had given sample set of rule in 3rd post of this thread.
Feel free to raise your doubts / findings/ observations here and lets discuss them.

I have used these only as filters to switch to breakout mode while trading US Markets. I already have the indicators on tradestation so I could get started quickly.

Eventually I would be interested to trade the Nifty which I intend to within a month of so. I've also learnt to import EOD data for NIfty to TS but am wondering whether it would work for intraday....once that happens I can post my alerts here for everyone....
Its good that you already have NRx indicator developed. So as long as you get NIFTY data feed, it will do the basic job. Though it will need work to develop an indicator to a tradeable system.
To start with you can get the basic rules from my 3rd post. Based on the outcome, then we can discuss how to fine tune. I must accept, I have not used proper system development tool like
TS strategy mgr / Ninja Trader - backtesting etc to test this.
I have seen these patterns working on NIFTY (they are not market specific but foundation is more on the emotions of market participants).

Looking forward for your contribution.
Happy Trading
 

Satyen

Well-Known Member
Take an example -
1) NR7 give us a trigger that new trend is going to start. So we get ready and start watching for entry signal
2) Next day market breaksout and depending on the direction we know that new trends has started.
3) As an example, Lets follow 3 moving averages (3bar/ 5bar/13bar) to guide us as long as trend is in place or not. As long as they are nicely arranged, we are in trend.
4) Lets use same 3 averages to show us end of trend - when we see 3 bar MA changeing direction and penetrating 5bar MA, we know the market is telling us something.
What action to take, depends on individual. Some will book profit on first sign of weakness. Some will wait for 10 more confirmations before changing their view that market has
reversed. Some will just tighten the stops.
5) To confirm the reversal, you might like to see, 1 Higher Low pivot as first signal. For confirmation of reversal, u might like to see the break of downward sloping Trendline.

These are just an example to get u thinking. Please spend some time and define your indicators / signal / market pattern etc and then just watchout for it.



Hope this helps.

Happy Trading.

Thanks can we go down to say 10 min or 15 min time frame once we get these NR patterns on Daily and trade with Moving avrage ........for intraday

And in 30 min chart for takin positions overnight with same 3,5 and 13 moving avg ....
 
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Re: My two cents on NR7s, ID/NR4s, Double NR7s

Lazytrader,
Critical range may not be the right term but I will look into my files and get you the exact formula Linda uses to calculate her range to bracket the trades following an NR7 or an ID/NR4 day. Back then, she disclosed the formula for those people who emailed her following the seminar in Ft Lauderdale which I took years ago. I'm not sure whether she still treats it as proprietary. She usually adds/subtracts a percent of the value once she gets that number from a very simple formula. More importantly she changes that value based on how markets change in volatility over a period of time. Thats something you have to figure out yourself based on market volatility. You can actually do that yourself by programming historical volatility ratios for a given market..

Trading breakouts is a good way to make a living particularly using intraday and end of the day strategies using the daily charts, IMO. HOwever one has to put up with the whipsaws.

I've been learning to understand support and resistance levels better on multiple time frames.......imagine if you can get an edge on other traders who trade breakouts...

a good analogy is - imagine you getting a very good seat on the train before everyone starts dogpiling at the same time once you get the seat of your choice, very early and you ride it......and more you are always ready to feed the ducks that quack when everyone starts dogpiling those breakouts...

I've not gone through threads here and it might be mentioned by other LBR students. So you might find the formula here..it's very simple really...

I might have to learn how to PM you or maybe email you when I retrieve it from my file. I have the NR7 and ID/NR4 indicators on TS platform which I use as a filter to switch to breakout mode after a range contraction day.

Now the key is can one really predict the direction of a breakout? I think its possible.

Years ago I came across a strategy called Gipsons(by Larry Connors in one of his books on advanced strategies). I have that book in my library somewhere and can find the rules if you are interested.....we can see how it works for other markets. It did work very well for stocks but wasn't so sure about futures markets here in the US.

Sorry this post is so long....
Regards
Shreenath
Can you explain critical range or tell me where I can find the explanation?
 
Hello AW10
I intend to go through that post of yours today and get back to you soon.

Yeah, I was fortunate enough to snag an original copy of Crable's book about 8 years ago. But I didnt know about Crable if I hadn't read LBR's book called Street Smarts which was released in 1999. I feel every day trader or swing trader should read Linda's book. It's worth so much more than the price of the book. I've mine personally autographed by Linda.

Regards
Shreenath

Hi Shreenath. Good to see your interest in Toby's patterns.



I consider IDNRx setup as subset of NRx setup so don't scan for them seperately. ID (Inside day), whether it is NR or not, always is good pattern to monitor. It indicates the conslidation. By default
as soon as you have ID, you are guranteed to have NR2 day atleast.



Shreenath, certainly we can discuss here and develop a system. For benefits of others who would like to develop a system, I had given sample set of rule in 3rd post of this thread.
Feel free to raise your doubts / findings/ observations here and lets discuss them.



Its good that you already have NRx indicator developed. So as long as you get NIFTY data feed, it will do the basic job. Though it will need work to develop an indicator to a tradeable system.
To start with you can get the basic rules from my 3rd post. Based on the outcome, then we can discuss how to fine tune. I must accept, I have not used proper system development tool like
TS strategy mgr / Ninja Trader - backtesting etc to test this.
I have seen these patterns working on NIFTY (they are not market specific but foundation is more on the emotions of market participants).

Looking forward for your contribution.
Happy Trading
 
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