Market Operators - Do they exist ? Who actually runs the show?

[djsan007]

Hello Friend.
How aptly put. I am a relatively new trader since december 08 only and I have observed the phenomina almost every day since them. You have already mentioned the case of Educomp, else I would havce definately mentioned it and also the Raju letter know to the general public only in the afternoon. Another case is that of Akruti in the past month when the stock started from 750 odd and reached 2300 in 4-5 days. Absloutely impossiable without any relevant news and also that of RIIL vary lately. Akruti was fun while it lasted and was good money machine. I was alert to get out of the stock just a day before it crashed. There are ample examples everyday to watchout for. I liked the quote one mentioned on Warren Buffet. Had a whole hearted laugh, even now, LOL!
Since I'm a full time broker myself, I've observed some very small and keen nitty gritties of this markets. It's a very good thread you have here. Good Job! Will keep posting as and when I have valuable inputs.
Oh BTW what does the name mean or represent "ACTUARYINMAKING". Give me a nick to address you. Mines's McNish. So Long !

When Sebi new there was an error in Akruti then y did they allowed people 2 trade cpl of days b4 it got crashed....

 

[McNish]

Hi DJ. To your query. When akruti started rising, it was like any other script whose price start to rise normally when it starts to be bought. The initial thrust was given by the market operator for a day and a half. After that the real market tookm over and the stock kept reaching higher limits SEBI realised this only after 2 to 3 days I guess. The grapevine has it that it was being operated by someone at Kanpur and I live in Lucknow, close by. So thats how it was.

 

[balraj167]

Hi Actuaryinmaking,

I found this thread very informative so please do post continuously.

Regards
Balram

 

[sudoku1]

The grapevine has it that it was being operated by someone at Kanpur and I live in Lucknow, close by. So thats how it was.

IT was shorted by 'white & white' fame (rk.dam..i)

 

[actuaryinmaking]

Weighted indices can be Managed if not manipulated. Select a few biggies like Reliance and maintance a positive bias on the index while selling across the broader market. Index watchers are happy that the inex has gone up when in reality there has been lot of selling all around. we can see happen on the nifty rather frequently.

Karthik,

Awesome Awesome Awesome observation...

This is exactly what has been happening in recent past...Nifty has been taken to 3500 levels from 2525 levels within time frame of just 4 weeks...

- RIL has been taken from 1200 levels to 1800 levels
- NTPC has been taken from 170 to 190 levels (every Rupee rise in NTPC has more baring then any of Nifty 50 scrips)
- SBI from 950 levels to 1300 levels

The game seems to be to keep Nifty solidly floating at 3300-3600 levels, create positive bias..while Operators buy midcaps and other hangers at low price then bring up the same midcap and double the outcome....

This is played very very intelligently...

-If I own(or have power to influence) CNBC.
-If I own(or have power to influence) ET New Paper press.
-If I have lots of money (or have group of enity whose money I can combine).
-If I have a power to influence/manipulate corporate performances.
-If I have a power to influence government and SEBI..
-If I have a team of intellectual good at creating/designing market games/traps

If so why can't I manipulate the market ??

Remember shares floating for transactions in market is most of the times less then 49% of total shares....it is not difficult to create multiple dummy trading entity and run circular trading among them (as you only buy and ypu sell so virtually no loss no gain except brokerage)..meanwhile orchestrate entire game to lure public and trap them...take their money..95% will get trapped.

In country like us where Peon to PM everyone is corrupt(this is bitter truth whether we accept it not) ..do we accept Stock Exchanges to run fair games ??

 

[lancer]

It has been like that from inception.

Hi actuaryinmaking,

This is a nice thread. Manipulations are real everyhere, in every sphere of modern life. The problem with stock market is that the novice retail individual investors who contribute and invest their realtime money normally get caught at higher levels and are trapped.
Practically the only problem with the individual investor is that he knows nothing about risk mamagement and even if he knows greed and the frustration of entering late into the rally blinds him. So the only way is restrain, caution but can it subdue human instincts of thriving for more? Adoption of the principles of animal world may help. Satisfy your hunger for the day and wait for the new day to beat the manupulators. And it take serious practice!

Nirmal Katecha is the latest of the race but he himself got trapped and resorted to forgery or else he would have vanished into the sea other investors.

Happy trading.

LB

 

[satdat]

pls look up kwality dairy
531882
and tell your views

 

[Sunny1]

Karthik,

Awesome Awesome Awesome observation...

This is exactly what has been happening in recent past...Nifty has been taken to 3500 levels from 2525 levels within time frame of just 4 weeks...

- RIL has been taken from 1200 levels to 1800 levels
- NTPC has been taken from 170 to 190 levels (every Rupee rise in NTPC has more baring then any of Nifty 50 scrips)
- SBI from 950 levels to 1300 levels

The game seems to be to keep Nifty solidly floating at 3300-3600 levels, create positive bias..while Operators buy midcaps and other hangers at low price then bring up the same midcap and double the outcome....

This is played very very intelligently...

-If I own(or have power to influence) CNBC.
-If I own(or have power to influence) ET New Paper press.
-If I have lots of money (or have group of enity whose money I can combine).
-If I have a power to influence/manipulate corporate performances.
-If I have a power to influence government and SEBI..
-If I have a team of intellectual good at creating/designing market games/traps

If so why can't I manipulate the market ??

Remember shares floating for transactions in market is most of the times less then 49% of total shares....it is not difficult to create multiple dummy trading entity and run circular trading among them (as you only buy and ypu sell so virtually no loss no gain except brokerage)..meanwhile orchestrate entire game to lure public and trap them...take their money..95% will get trapped.

In country like us where Peon to PM everyone is corrupt(this is bitter truth whether we accept it not) ..do we accept Stock Exchanges to run fair games ??

It is not only India but All the high economic countries are corrupt even US & Aust & etc, only difference is that in our country corruption is bit open subject

 

[Ganesh543]

Thx Prabhjeetji,

Satyam case is totally different..IMHO I would label it as white colored open fraud...let's not go there

1) What is the reason why we are seeing Educomp roughly 200+- Rs everyday since it's listing..what is changing everyday in it's supply/demand or risk/opportunities??

2) Why is Aban falling like a sharp knife with utter silence from everywhere?

3) Why delivery % in all stocks transaction is merely 25% on average on any day - this means only Short/Long selling happening for whooping 75% of the times...

:clap::clapping:
wow yes I agree with you 100 percent
Thanks
Hare Krishna
Ganesh

 

[actuaryinmaking]

Yes true..ultimately market works on....

1) DEMAND vs SUPPLY.
2) ASK PRICE Vs BID PRICE.
2) ANTICIPATION vs REALITY of what could be past/present/future "Worth of Trading Instrument"

But...

DEMAND Vs SUPPLY is engineered (like many other trading instruments) and so is ANTICIPATED and perceived REAL "Worth of Trading Instrument".

Why is it engineered..?

So that it can fluctuate in big ways such a that someone can..
1) sell direct equity at higher price and buy at lower price....
2) earn on Futs discount/premium price movements (specially near expiry)
3) earn on Options (specially near expiry for next months Options)

How is it engineered?

This is complex science and no one except those who are doing it knows it in detail..but in my close observation this is what is seen...

Price of each scrip in Nifty is moved in synchronization...to hold nifty at let say some level..one scrip (per say let say SBI,RIL,ONGC, LnT etc) is moved up and then halted there..again other is moved and halted there...then first one is moved down etc etc etc....it is like Piano with 50 keys...they keep pressing it one after other..up down down up up up down down...in such a way that each scrip and nifty results in desire levels to fulfill the main objectives as in above point...

So who is doing it?

Smart Money, Market Makers, DII, FII, Market Operators, Bull Cartel, Bear Cartel etc etc...it is all involved network...even I suspect Corporate Management of each scrip is also involved in such moves...

Options are the biggest earning instruments for them in the market

Though I am not saying each and every move is engineered but many of them are...this is my humble opinion and close observations while monitoring Nifty heat maps price and volume movements etc etc your views may be different and totally opposites...it's just my two cents !

Ultimately...

Piano is played in such a way that it psyches general retailers GREED,FEAR,DOUBT and HOPE emotions...and ultimately traps them and rest is known after that.....those who plays with the trend and over comes all these four enemies are winner and those who goes against them and makes these four guys as friends are loosers..

What can we do to b winner?

• Discipline Discipline and Discipline - win your four enemies GREED,FEAR,DOUBT and HOPE....bit them with Trade plan with reason for entry in the trade, Strick SL, money and risk management etc etc.
  
• Trade the trend never ever try to trade what you think..trade what tune market is playing...

rgds, Nisha

Same Buyers Same Sellers - cricular trading..prices are automatically rised...!!

Doesnt SEBI/NSE/Deptt of Corporate Affair know this ??