Low Risk Options Trading Strategy - Option Spreads

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nac

Well-Known Member
Hi,

Why would anyone choose Long Straddle over Long Strangle? I have tested both strategies for same expiry 25 Nov 2010. Nifty @5983:

Long Straddle
-------------
Long Call 6000 @ 148
Long Put 6000 @ 124

Max Loss:-272
Lower Breakeven: 5727
Upper Breakeven: 6272

Long Strangle
-------------
Long Put 5900 @ 85
Long Call 6100 @ 98

Max Loss:-183
Lower Breakeven: 5717
Upper Breakeven: 6282

Notice here, that Long Strangle has a lower Max Loss than Long Straddle. But, the breakeven points are the same. Both strategies are going long so time decay will be negative in both cases.

So, what is the advantage of Long Straddle over Long Strangle??:confused:
Assume that market closes @ 5750 on expiry

In Straddle you will lose only Rs. 22/- Whereas
In Strangle you will lose all the premium you paid i.e. Rs. 183/-
 

trader_man

Well-Known Member
Perhaps, strangle's max loss is smaller than straddle. But probability of losing all the amount (premium paid) on strangle is higher than straddle.

Risk chart of straddle looks like "V" and strangle looks like "BOAT"/"CUP". Probability of closing very end of "V" is lesser than closing anywhere within rim of the "BOAT"
When I compare the 2 graphs, it doesn't really make sense. Imagine that you have put a horizontal line just above the tip of the V in the Long Straddle....It becomes a Long Strangle. So, probabilities don't really matter. Also, I checked the exact probabilities, and they are the same.
 
NOW is much better than anything else I have worked on till date.. faster, more reliable...because I am scalping, I have realized most of the times I am seeing it 1 tick faster than any of my other terminals.. Charting is just average.... doesnt matter as I use amibroker for the same... cheers...
 
What I have realized is, whatever strategies I have come up till date, if it was not for the gut, I wouldn't have entered any..... the last half hour movement yesterday showed **** loads of volatility, and typically I have been shorting at the money calls and puts around expiry every month and exit it on the immediate monday morning... On an average has made me a little money, lost me money only once in the last 8 months...Did the yesterday strategy make money??? was short 20 lots each, was able to get out bookin 1 point profit..... The crazy bit with my current broker is, I still make money... :) .. breakeven is at 12 paise if i trade 20 lots.. including all the taxes and the brokerage.... up 900 bucks, not the most profitable trade of my life, but takes care of the beer for the weeknd.. ;)..
 

DanPickUp

Well-Known Member
Part three in : The hidden problems for not experienced option traders

A short repetition : The first part showed behind the spread : Long call , short future and the second part pointed out the call credit spread. We speak here about a four leg strategy. In any option trading strategy with so many legs, we have to analyze each leg very carefully and we have to know our traded market very well.

Why did I start this little, open showed analyses of this special strategy ?

Here the reason : A friend of mine wrote me this PM : ""Lets assume the Nifty goes up. The sold call gains more than the bought call, and the sold future loses too. Now the loss is more, than before selling the future. If the Nifty goes down, then the position is back in profit. Isn't it much simpler to close out the bought call and buy a put instead?""

You may remember, that I wrote in part one about the strategy : ""Sounds easy, but has a few details which can become nasty !"" When you read this PM, he was thinking about the nasty hidden problem in this strategy which could more likely happen, when traded in an other time frame as it could happen, in the short time frame it was created for. The short time frame was in a certain way a protection, that this not should happen. Implemented in a longer time frame, the possibility that this could happen is more likely there. As trading is married with possibility and probability, we have to think in the way it is done in this PM.

If it gets to complicated now, lets recap : ""If nifty goes up, the sold call gains more than the bought call ""

This could likely happen, when the call credit spread is to big ( Strike prices are to far away from each other ) or the bid ask price in the spread is far to big, as this likely happens in nifty option pricing. Also let us assume, that the sold call is deep in the money and the bought call is otm. In that case, the sold call would act different than the bought call. The itm call would lose much more than the otm call. This could led to a dis balance in the call credit spread by it self and loss could occur as mentioned in the PM. In that situation ( Longer time frame, big range between the options and big bid ask price ), the loss even could occur in the whole four leg strategy. Not to significant, but it could.

If I under such circumstances then ask the question : ""Isn't it much simpler to close out the bought call and buy a put instead? "" , the answer can be yes. But I wrote ; Can be and not must be ! Why ? Even than : It also could be running from one trouble in to the other, when after buying the put and selling the call the market has changed his mind again and likes to go up and so on. So : Can be and not must be !

As you should create option strategy scenarios with the mentioned points and thoughts in part one, two and three, you should likely not get in much trouble.

If you are not able, to create such fine tuned stuff, then let it be and use the mentioned way for example from AW10 to trade simple credit spreads in a more or less secure way. As there is anyway no 100% sure in trading, you will have to take a risk when ever entering any trade. This risk has to look like that :

""A well disciplined and rule following cash management could never face a risk which could be sudden. It always results into a calculated well defined risk. Once a risk/reward ratio is predefined and determined, result and risk would always be minimal. As in most incidences, loss in profits rather than in capital.""

With this post, I will end the subject and wish you good success.

I hope, you had an eye opener about what option trading really is.

Take care :)

DanPickUp
 

DanPickUp

Well-Known Member
Hi,

Why would anyone choose Long Straddle over Long Strangle? I have tested both strategies for same expiry 25 Nov 2010. Nifty @5983:

Long Straddle
-------------
Long Call 6000 @ 148
Long Put 6000 @ 124

Max Loss:-272
Lower Breakeven: 5727
Upper Breakeven: 6272

Long Strangle
-------------
Long Put 5900 @ 85
Long Call 6100 @ 98

Max Loss:-183
Lower Breakeven: 5717
Upper Breakeven: 6282

Notice here, that Long Strangle has a lower Max Loss than Long Straddle. But, the breakeven points are the same. Both strategies are going long so time decay will be negative in both cases.

So, what is the advantage of Long Straddle over Long Strangle??:confused:
Hi trader_man

It should be written : If you implement a Straddle atm, adjust it with a strangle otm.

( If market moves against you on both side, first adjust on the put / call side and on the other side of the range, adjust with call / put )

If this two more legs are implemented with the same options expiration date , then you can say, that you adjusted a straddle with a strangle and this you can take as a clear rule in your trading plan. Simple and very effective in some markets.

Hope this clears the confusion and sorry for the very miss interpreting typing mistake.

DanPickUp
 

trader_man

Well-Known Member
Hi trader_man
( If market moves against you on both side, first adjust on the put / call side and on the other side of the range, adjust with call / put )

If this two more legs are implemented with the same options expiration date , then you can say, that you adjusted a straddle with a strangle and this you can take as a clear rule in your trading plan. Simple and very effective in some markets.


DanPickUp
Sorry boss, but I don't understand. I will try and test out what you are suggesting. If you could provide some examples that would be great.
 

DanPickUp

Well-Known Member
Sorry boss, but I don't understand. I will try and test out what you are suggesting. If you could provide some examples that would be great.
Hi trader_man

I am not your boss. In trading, you are your own boss :)

If you do not understand, that is no problem. Do not worry about that.

On the other hand, you also have to accept, that it is not my job, to present here one strategy after one.

I gave now a real deeper lock in creating and thinking about more leg strategies. Use that knowledge and if it has to be more, here my solution :

What do you think : Would it not be time to read books now ?

DanPickUp
 
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