Looking for a CA for help in derivative trading taxation

#41
hello,

my apologies that i didnt clear the options part of calculations.

to be very frank there are a number of speculations as to how to determine turnover of options. i have came across a number of different ways of calculating depending on what the client feels comfortable with.

i particularly am comfortable with the following way of calculation

now as per the ICAI guidance note:

1. the premium received on sale of an option is included in your turnover
hence if you sale 1lot option of X stock (1lot of 500 shares) at a premium of rs 10 than your premium received will be Rs.5000. now if the trade is fully favorable to you then the option will expire and you will gain entire 5000. hence this is your turnover. if the option is not favorable and you square of the position gaining say Rs.3000 then again the Entire Rs.5000 is your turnover but the buy premium, which you had paid, of Rs. 2000 will be accounted for as your Expense.

2. premium paid on buy a call or put is straight away an expense which is not to be included in turnover when it expires worth less. if you square off (which is ultimately selling) the position before expiry then again the sale premium is the turnover and buy premium is expense.

3. in case for the outstanding contracts on 31/03/20xx. one can totally ignore the same and take the turnover in the year of expiry.

yes i do agree that the valuation of option is very vague. there is no straight set rule to value option turnover or for the unexpired contracts.

the bitter truth is yes this what the department wants either you pay on calculations of 8% or go for audit to claim lower income.

Please Note: the above are my views of calculating the turnover based on number of practical situation and limitations to clear set of Rules. the same may be contradictory to others opinions. please use with discretion.

Regards.
CA. Ritesh Bafna
HI Ritesh,
As you already said that there might different ways to calculate options turnover so is it also correct to say that options turnover= premium recd. + Premium Paid.
 
#42
HI Ritesh,
As you already said that there might different ways to calculate options turnover so is it also correct to say that options turnover= premium recd. + Premium Paid.
yes. but this method is not advised in ICAI guidelines

this will only increase your turnover and hence presumtive profit will also increase.

Regards
CA. Ritesh Bafna
 
#44
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#45
Thanks Ritesh for reply and as i have understood it you are saying that premium paid should be deducted from turnover.
no.

premium paid is considered your expense.

the same is not to be deducted from turnover.
 

TraderRavi

low risk profile
#47
hi ritesh,
1) if I buy an nifty option having price 100 (lot size 50) so total premium paid = 5000 , and then sell it for 110 (premium received = 5500) , so net profit = 5500 - 5000 = 500 Rs., now what is the turnover in this case ?
2) now if I do the above same option transaction by selling first then buying later , what will be the turnover?
3) if I buy nifty future @ 6000(lot size 50) and sell it @ 6050, what will be the turnover ?
 
Last edited:

LML

New Member
#48
Hi Ritesh,

I have gone through your thread and appreciate the wonderful work you are doing for people out here. I have started trading in FO since the middle of last year. I am now filing my tax returns and that is when I landed at this website and this thread. Having gone through your thread, I have one basic question for which I couldn't get answer till now.

For calculation of turnover for futures it is the sum total of your net losses and gains, that is fine. But I want to understand whether the net loss is per trade or contractwise. e.g. If i have traded Nifty Futures Dec 12 series for all 20 trading days of Dec 12 and Nifty Futures Jan 13 series for entire 20 trading days of Jan 13. Then to arrive at the turnover should I add net profit or loss for each of the 40 days or I have to add only the total net profit or loss added for Dec12 contract and Jan 13 contract put together.

Hope I am clear in asking my question.

e.g.
1 Dec 12 : Buy Dec Nifty futures 1 lot (50) @ 5000 = 250000
1 Dec 12 : Sell Dec Nifty furures 1 lot (50) @ 5050 = 252500
Profit = 2500.....A
2 Dec 12 : Buy Dec Nifty futures 1 lot (50) @ 5050 = 252500
2 Dec 12 : Sell Dec Nifty furures 1 lot (50) @ 5030 = 251500
Loss = (1000).....B

Net Profit for Dec Nifty futures = (A) - (B) = 1500.....C

1 Jan 13 : Buy Jan Nifty futures 1 lot (50) @ 5500 = 275000
1 Dec 12 : Sell Jan Nifty furures 1 lot (50) @ 5560 = 278000
Profit = 3000.....D

2 Jan 13 : Buy Jan Nifty futures 1 lot (50) @ 5600 = 280000
2 Jan 13 : Sell Jan Nifty furures 1 lot (50) @ 5500 = 275000
Loss = (5000).....E

Net Loss of Jan Nifty futures = (D) - (E) = (2000).....F

So for calculating turnover, should it be A + B + D + E = 2500+1000+3000+5000 = 11500

OR

should the turnover be = C + F = 1500+2000 = 3500


Eagerly await your reply.
 
#50
Hi Ritesh,

I have gone through your thread and appreciate the wonderful work you are doing for people out here. I have started trading in FO since the middle of last year. I am now filing my tax returns and that is when I landed at this website and this thread. Having gone through your thread, I have one basic question for which I couldn't get answer till now.

For calculation of turnover for futures it is the sum total of your net losses and gains, that is fine. But I want to understand whether the net loss is per trade or contractwise. e.g. If i have traded Nifty Futures Dec 12 series for all 20 trading days of Dec 12 and Nifty Futures Jan 13 series for entire 20 trading days of Jan 13. Then to arrive at the turnover should I add net profit or loss for each of the 40 days or I have to add only the total net profit or loss added for Dec12 contract and Jan 13 contract put together.

Hope I am clear in asking my question.

e.g.
1 Dec 12 : Buy Dec Nifty futures 1 lot (50) @ 5000 = 250000
1 Dec 12 : Sell Dec Nifty furures 1 lot (50) @ 5050 = 252500
Profit = 2500.....A
2 Dec 12 : Buy Dec Nifty futures 1 lot (50) @ 5050 = 252500
2 Dec 12 : Sell Dec Nifty furures 1 lot (50) @ 5030 = 251500
Loss = (1000).....B

Net Profit for Dec Nifty futures = (A) - (B) = 1500.....C

1 Jan 13 : Buy Jan Nifty futures 1 lot (50) @ 5500 = 275000
1 Dec 12 : Sell Jan Nifty furures 1 lot (50) @ 5560 = 278000
Profit = 3000.....D

2 Jan 13 : Buy Jan Nifty futures 1 lot (50) @ 5600 = 280000
2 Jan 13 : Sell Jan Nifty furures 1 lot (50) @ 5500 = 275000
Loss = (5000).....E

Net Loss of Jan Nifty futures = (D) - (E) = (2000).....F

So for calculating turnover, should it be A + B + D + E = 2500+1000+3000+5000 = 11500

OR

should the turnover be = C + F = 1500+2000 = 3500


Eagerly await your reply.
Hello, this part is covered in my previous posts... Correct turnover is 11500.

Regards
CA Ritesh Bafna
 

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