•Did you learn how to ride a bike by reading a book?

suri112000

Well-Known Member
#1
Did you learn how to drive a car by reading a book?
Do pilots learn how to fly by reading a book?


Well trying to teach someone all the ins and outs of trading via a website/book/writeup is like trying to teach brain surgery with a book.

Trading is a highly complex skill like brain surgery and you can't learn how to perform brain surgery by reading about it, and you ultimately can't learn to be a successful trader by reading about it or scouring the web trying to piece together free information.

Essentially people shouldn't try to "self-educate" and learn how to trade on their own.

At a gut level we all know you can't learn how to be a successful trader purely from a book. That's an absurd assumption and it would be similar to thinking we can learn how to perform surgery on someone from reading a book or two.

We may have the mechanics down, but would YOU let someone perform brain surgery on you if you knew they learned how to do so from reading a book?

Trading is a skill where you need some kind of coaching or mentorship, but that's what I think, ultimately it's your life and only you can decide that.

Change the topic.

Human instincts are often wrong and you must learn to resist these feelings that will lose you money. The way probability works is important to trading but is different than your natural instincts will lead you to believe. The Gambler's fallacy, also known as the fallacy of the maturity of chances is the belief that your odds improve when an unusual series of losses occur or that your odds of winning rises when you have a losing streak.

Let's look at a coin flip example:

if you are flipping a coin and you get "heads" four times in a row then your chances of getting "tails" on the next coin toss has improved. However, each coin toss is an independent event that is ignorant of every previous coin toss. Since the coin does not remember the previous string of heads it is not biased in the next toss.

If fifty different people toss a coin in the air eight different times then the probability of at least one person getting all heads or tails is 32.44%. That person with all heads (or tails) probably had difficulty accepting the outcome but it is no less probable that the person who had exactly 25 heads and 25 tails which were evenly distributed.

Another example of how human intuition is wrong is the Monte Hall paradox and Bertrand's box paradox.

You are in a game show, and you're given the choice of three doors: Behind one door is Rs. 1,000; behind the others, Re. 1. You pick door No. 1, and the host (who knows the right answer) opens door No. 3, which has Re.1. He then says to you, "Do you want to pick door No. 2?" Should you switch your choice from Door No. 1 to Door No. 2? Most people would say no because their chance has not seemingly changed and Door No. 2 does not seem to offer any improvement in their chance of winning. People are more inclined to stay with their choice once made. Staying with your choice leaves you with a 1/3 chance of winning but changing to door No.2 increases your chances to 2/3. It is surprising and not at all intuitive but it has been shown to be true (hence the term "paradox"). As a trader you should learn what is true and re-train yourself to these truths while avoiding use of your natural human instinct. Why something works in trading is unimportant, that is an academic exercise for the curious; the fact that it works is all you need to know.

For many people it is hard to exit a losing trade and accept defeat. People who have been reasonably successful in their life would rather hang in there and work that defeat into a victory. This is a recipe for disaster in trading. After several disasters the aspiring trader then over reacts and starts exiting too soon. They want to exit a trade if there is any loss showing at all because the pain of past disasters puts them in a panic. Knowing how to trade means limiting your losers and giving your winners room to run.
 

suri112000

Well-Known Member
#2
Learning from a good mentor is the best. Many are not fortunate enough to get a good mentor. They have to make efforts of their own to learn to trade profitably.

I will give here one mechanical system which if played without any deviations from the rules would make money. It is a system which is always in the trade whether long or short. A thorough understand of the rules and a flawless execution is a must to realize its potential. Be not afraid that it should be a tough one. It is picked up from my vast collection of AFLs from various sources. The clue is not in the AFL but the rules. No more intuition or emotional trading. First practice it on some volatile scrip with just 1 share to get acquainted with the skill to execute the trades flawlessly. When the confidence builds up switch to Nifty futures with 1 lot initially. As the confidence further builds up, you can trade higher number of lots and/or trade in Banknifty futures as well.

Mind you friends ........ you are trying your hand at a hard skill without a trainer. You are bound to get injured in the process. Donot leave it in between. Did we when we learnt bike riding? Recall the process and events which led you to acquire the skill of bike riding. I donot know about others but I did break my knees and elbows a number of times. Alas! I am now a skilled biker.:D
 

suri112000

Well-Known Member
#3
Here is the AFL. Copy and save it in custome folder. After saving it, double click it, the chart appears.

SetChartOptions( 0, chartShowArrows|chartShowDates );

_SECTION_BEGIN("Price Chart");
_N(Title = StrFormat("{{NAME}}- {{INTERVAL}} {{DATE}} O= %g, H= %g, L= %g, C= %g (%.1f%%) V= " +WriteVal( V, 1.0 ) +"\n{{VALUES}}", O, H, L, C, SelectedValue( ROC( C, 1 )) ));
PriceStyle = GetPriceStyle();
PriceStyleOpt = ParamStyle("Price Style")|PriceStyle;

if (PriceStyle==styleCandle)
Plot( C, "", colorBlack, PriceStyleOpt);
else
Plot( C, "", IIf( Close >= Ref(C, -1), colorBlue, colorRed ), PriceStyleOpt);
_SECTION_END();
SetPositionSize (1, spsShares);

_SECTION_BEGIN("BW Fractal");

/* UpFractal= ValueWhen( */
SellFractal= ValueWhen(
(Ref(H,-2) > Ref(H, -4)) AND
(Ref(H,-2) > Ref(H, -3)) AND
(Ref(H,-2) > Ref(H, -1)) AND
(Ref(H,-2) > H), Ref(H,-2));

/* DownFractal= ValueWhen( */
BuyFractal= ValueWhen(
(Ref(L,-2) <= Ref(L, -4)) AND
(Ref(L,-2) <= Ref(L, -3)) AND
(Ref(L,-2) <= Ref(L, -1)) AND
(Ref(L,-2) <= L), Ref(L,-2));


NewSellFractal=(Ref(SellFractal,2) > Ref(SellFractal,1) OR Ref(SellFractal,2) < Ref(SellFractal,1));
NewBuyFractal=(Ref(BuyFractal,2) > Ref(BuyFractal,1) OR Ref(BuyFractal,2) < Ref(BuyFractal,1) );
PlotShapes(IIf(NewSellFractal,shapeUpTriangle,shapeNone),colorBlue,0,Low,Offset=-18);
PlotShapes(IIf(NewBuyFractal,shapeDownTriangle,shapeNone),colorBlack,0,High,Offset=-18);
_SECTION_END();
Now, select Syndicate Bank Scrip.

Plot the chart on 15 min.

Many of you aware of Bill Williams fractals and his chaos theory. If not google and find out.

A buy fractal is formed when one bar high is preceded with two lower highs and succeeded by two lower highs. A buy fractal is valid only when two successive lower highs are formed and bars closed (bars should not be in formation). Buy fractal is shown as Blue triangle upward turned in the chart.

Likewise a sell fractal is shown as Black triangle downward turned.


Now, select Syndicate Bank Scrip.

Trade with only 1 share.

Buy when upfractal high is broken. Hold until a recent sell fractal is broken. When recent sell fractal is broken. Sell 2 shares one to set off buy position and one is for fresh short. Likewise keep rotating the trades until EOD. Close the positions at EOD because you cannot carry forward short positions to next day in Cash Segment. Even if it is buy position at EOD close the positions.

Next day, check what was the position at EOD whether long or short. Had we not closed the trade at EOD, we would have carried positions next day...right?
Wait for first 15 min to close. Check whether the close is in tune with yesterday's trade. If yes and no new reverse fractal is broken by the close of first 15 min candle enter the trade in same lines yesterday's carry forward of trade.

You should have a clear 20 trading trades without even a single error. If any error occurs in between, start counting the days again from day one until 20.

I myself failed 6 times in this test.:D
 
#5
Sorry Wrong post . . .

As pointed out by the OP it does not Apply here . . .


Cheers

Thanks
 
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suri112000

Well-Known Member
#7
Hello

How to practice SAR system with cash scrips (using 1 or maybe 10 shares)?

A SAR system alternates between Long and Short states, with cash scrip we can easily go Long by buying 1/10 shares but how to trade short???

Here is a trick we can use to execute short trades for testing/learning/practicing to execute a SAR system.

Step 01: We wear the HAT of a Positional Investor and Buy/invest 1 or 10 shares of the scrip we want to trade in.

Step 02:
We wear the Trader's HAT and start trading the system . . .
a: When we get a Long signal we buy/go long on decided quantity
b: When we get a Short signal we use the shares bought previous in investor's mode for delivery . . .

Now at end of our testing/practice period we return (notionally) the borrowed shares to the investor,
with this we not only test the SAR system but also have a Buy & Hold test for the same period
with Step 1 is Buy/Hold and Step 2 is the execution of the SAR system.

Thanks
Good for big capital players.

However, we are not holding overnight positions with cash segment.
 
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suri112000

Well-Known Member
#8
Why row 33-34 shows long-long while it should be long-short ???
Last trade trade is an adjustment entry of 1st long (sl no.1). In a nutshell the long in 34 and exit in 1 is the trade which is split and shown as two trades (1 and 34) as I missed it to enter at the start.
 

mastermind007

Well-Known Member
#9
Hi Suri

This Buy Fractal and Sell Fractal logic is the basis of the T3B system. T3B has following more filters/conditions added to it.

1) Charting is End of Day only.
2) Trade decisions are made after hours when markets are closed and orders are added to the trading system for next trading day.
3) High (or Low) being broken upwards (or downwards) needs to be a significant one (3 month, 6 month, 1 year, ... 5 year and so on)
3a) And also the overall trend for the scrip is in congruence with the intended trade.
4) Accumulated Volume needs to be above 125 day simple moving average
5) KRA Line needs to be low. KRA is the only thing for which formula is not 100% accurately known.
6) Position may be Long, Short or nothing. It is not unwise to avoid being in market all the time.




P.S. Did you not read the famous best-selling book that teaches riding a bike by reading a book? :)
 
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mastermind007

Well-Known Member
#10
Suri

My humble suggestion is to add following two lines in AFL to plot the lines

Code:
Plot(SellFractal, "Up", ParamColor("Up Fractal Color",colorBlue), styleNoTitle| styleStaircase | ParamStyle("Up Fractal Style", styleLine) | styleNoLabel);
Plot(BuyFractal, "Down",ParamColor("Down Fractal Color",colorRed), styleNoTitle| ParamStyle("Down Fractal Style", styleLine)| styleNoLabel);
and to get rid of following four lines (that rely on future quotes)

Code:
NewSellFractal=(Ref(SellFractal,2) > Ref(SellFractal,1) OR Ref(SellFractal,2) < Ref(SellFractal,1)); 
NewBuyFractal=(Ref(BuyFractal,2) > Ref(BuyFractal,1) OR Ref(BuyFractal,2) < Ref(BuyFractal,1) );
PlotShapes(IIf(NewSellFractal,shapeUpTriangle,shapeNone),colorBlue,0,Low,Offset=-18);
PlotShapes(IIf(NewBuyFractal,shapeDownTriangle,shapeNone),colorBlack,0,High,Offset=-18);
 

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